Gas prices to rise $400 per year

Discussion in 'Energy' started by Mark, Oct 20, 2014.

  1. Mark

    Mark Founder Staff Member

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    Hear the latest news on gas prices? Apparently, they are set to skyrocket $400 per annum for the average household!

    I'm thinking of ditching my gas hot water burner and stove top and putting the extra 400 bucks into a solar hot water system plus more solar panels until I absolutely fill my rooftop!

    People may point the finger squarely at capitalism as the cause of wealth inequality but I don't believe that... I reckon it's simply human greed and ridiculously over inflated energy prices that is ruining the world and expanding the gap between rich and poor.

    The day of reckoning is coming for big energy and it might be sooner than later with the progress in solar power improving battery storage and more efficient energy capture at falling prices - watch this space (or should I say rooftop).
     
  2. stevo

    stevo Backyard Farmer Premium Member

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    I haven't kept up with gas news, but gees there'd be a lot of people annoyed about it. I assume a lot of people would be stuck with it and couldn't afford to change to solar.

    My neighbour has a fairly new solar hot water system, evacuated tube type system with a electric booster, I thought it was a pretty good idea. He says they haven't needed the electric booster yet. Their system was about $6000. Out of my price range, but they'll be retiring soon so have set themselves up for years of low cost living, in theory.

    Though technically, it still might be cheaper for you to pay the extra $400 for gas instead of change systems.

    You could also try to reduce consumption, if that's possible?

    You could set up an electric cook top and start using that instead of the gas stove, use the gas stove when ever you like but have the option for the electric cooktop. You can buy two element electric cooktops for $100, portable and plug in to 240v, so then you're using your current solar panel power.

    (not sure if any of that would work for your situation)
     
  3. Mark

    Mark Founder Staff Member

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    Now that's a bloody good idea! My stove isn't that old so it would probably be a waste of money to replace the whole thing just to upgrade the top burners.

    Actually, I have one those electric Sunbeams (in-laws gave it to us) in the shed it's new as so I might pull it out and start using it.

    6k for a solar hot water system is a little steep hey! Hell... :shock: Not sure if it is worth going down that path just yet as you say.

    I just got one of my 45kg gas cylinders replaced on Monday and it cost $150 I'm wondering if it would be cheaper to get my own cylinders and have them refilled myself! Probably. ..
     
  4. stevo

    stevo Backyard Farmer Premium Member

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    If you wanted to go cheap on the hot water system you could make your own dodgy set up in the yard somewhere with black hoses on the roof to heat the water in the sun, and shower at the end of the day, and the water could run off to the garden.
    Your family might not like the standard of facilities though.

    With storing hot water for bigger systems you'd want to make sure it was above 60 degrees....

    quote from the Elgas site
    ==========
    The Legionella bacteria can multiply exceptionally well in warm water, between 25° to 50°C. If infected water is inhaled in small airborne droplets of the water, as would happen when taking a shower, the individual could end up with the disease.
    The solution is to keep the hot water INSIDE the tank set to a minimum of 60°C. This applies to all electric and gas storage tank systems, including solar and heat pump units, which also have storage tanks. Your plumber would have set your system up to run at 60°C when it was installed.
    ==========

    I guess you'd have to work out which was costing more, gas or electric, when you're cooking with each device. You might have to record some stats over time?
     
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  5. Tim C

    Tim C Two heads are better than one Premium Member GOLD

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    I had solar hot water at Yandama Station. Apparently it only worked for about a week after it was installed. The electrics controlling the heat pump stopped working. I modified it, replacing the roof module sensor with a thermostat off an old HWS- one that can be adjusted down to zero C instead of 65 C like the new ones- That is because you don't want the external mounting point to get that hot or the water would literally be boiling. The original probe sensor required constant power, whereas the thermostat just completed the circuit when it cut out, by connection to the normal closed side of a 6 pin relay, the completed circuit through the thermostat holds relay open, powered by a 9-12v power supply, with the 240v pump connected to the other side of the relay. Not sure if a sparky would approve, but it worked and never gave any more trouble.
    You could use a roll of poly pipe chucked up on the roof with a fully adjustable thermostat on the top loop, plumbed through a 12v hot water pump off fleabay- through a relay too. Top coil to top(outlet) of HWS and bottom to bottom. Probably put the pump on the cold(inlet).
    As a point of interest, my little Nomad stove uses 140gms of gas per hour (max), per burner.
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
  6. Mark

    Mark Founder Staff Member

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    Personally, I reckon there's nothing like a good gas shower when the only time the hot water runs out is when the gas does! I just don't understand the hikes in gas prices and don't believe they are justified. I know our gas reserves cost a lot to set up but once they're running they scale back the people by 90% and then have product pumping out with only a maintenance staff for the next 50 years. We have a growing underclass in Australia and a lot of the household price pressures are coming from utilities like gas, which shouldn't cost a fortune to use. It worries me that pensioners like my mother spend the whole fortnight scrimping to ensure they cover utilities whereas my Grandparents seemed to have more money for discretionary spending during their retirement years.
     
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  7. Tim C

    Tim C Two heads are better than one Premium Member GOLD

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    Yeah it's been a big topic on the radio here. WA sets aside gas for domestic consumption, whereas all the other states are reliant on "market" price. Government everywhere sell off the utilities and give rogue capitalists open slather to wring every last cent out of us whilst there is no guarantee of infrasructure upkeep. Privatisation has not meant less government jobs. Just more shiny bums and less tradies in the public sector. PMG became Auspost and Telecom, then they sold the phone service. The country rail was all pulled out or abandoned, now they bitch about road upkeep, which has also been privatised. Short-sighted greed and denial of past lessons seem all the government is truly capable of. Shoot 'em all and start again, I say. Or send 'em to Manus Island for some of their own Human rights....
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2014
  8. Tim C

    Tim C Two heads are better than one Premium Member GOLD

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    I was just getting one of those little square electric instants going last week- a 1200w element inside a copper cube is all they are, with one of the old-style fully adjustable thermostats. Only thing is you need to regulate/turn off at the input, or they overflow(out overflow pipe), so it would need to be mounted higher than your shower head and with a separate tap/line. Could be done(old style) but not with a mixer tap. Thinking about setting mine up with an outside sink near the barby.
     
  9. Mark

    Mark Founder Staff Member

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    They need to monitor profits made by the energy giants and ensure they aren't simply making too much at the expense of the public.

    Utilities should never be used as a get rich scheme for shareholders or the privileged. Low income households should not be under living stress due to the cost of necessary utilities.

    Sure, put a reasonable cap on how much we can use before the tariff increases to stop waste or over use but they need to get prices of gas, electricity, and water, under control before they break the backs of the poor and middle class.
     
  10. Tim C

    Tim C Two heads are better than one Premium Member GOLD

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    Won't be long we'll all be living down on the riverbank in a tent with a fire, and the cities will be(more) full of desperates. When their posh homes are being broken into every night by people simply seeking food, it will be way too late for the upper class. Mark my words, it will have to come to this before they admit their pig-ignorant greed.
     
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  11. Jenni

    Jenni Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    Tim I agree it is a possibility living back on the riverbank. Talk is Australia will be a third world country in the future. Not sure if we will see it in our lifetime. Waste is definately a cause for high costs on all including gas. I think high prices have a lot to do with the Work place health and safety issues business have to comply with these days. Its absolute madness. I have a mate who works on gas mining and the unproductive cost wastage is ridiculous and mostly due to safety issues which aren't really safety issues just logic that has been thrown out the window. It totally blows me away.

    I remember when we didn't have a gas BBQ's and cooked with timber. I recon it tasted better.
     
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